77 W72 Y82 project

[72projectbird]

Some of you guys might remember I posted picking up a 77 SE a while back. It's time I finally did something with it.

The short story is I found it listed online in Maine, and bought it from the son of the original owner. His Dad bought it new at a local dealer, and spent its life up in Milo, ME. Somewhere along the line it was lightly customized by having the original striping hand painted, along with the bird being hand painted and gold leafed.

It's been sitting since 1995. It was shuffled from garage to garage, before being stuck in the woods and forgotten. We made a deal and after a 7 hour round trip it was in it's new home.

It still retains all its original panels, although will need some work on the quarters. Everything structural is perfect. The floor pans need some help, but I have a one piece floor for it. The trunk, rear rails, and tail panel are great.


I dropped the gas tank and surprisingly it was fine. I changed all the fluids, power washed the entire bottom of the car, threw in a fresh battery and a good carb I had laying around, and it fired right up. Great oil pressure, no smoke, no top end noise, nothing. Pretty cool.

My plan is to put it on the rotisserie and completely do it over, but currently my 70TA is on it, and I have a 78 W72 Y82 currently being painted, so instead of this bird sitting in the garage waiting its turn I decided I'm going to drive it like it is for a while.

I'm in the process of installing FiTech fuel injection, getting new tires, and giving it a once over. I'll be sure to document its journey back to life after 25 years of slumber in the woods.

The pics of it on the trailer is when I picked it up. The one of it up on the lift is after buffing the paint back with some agression compound on a rotary buffer. It actually shines up pretty good. lol

[tajoe]

Wow. For an upper New England F-body, the car looks really good underneath. And the ST-10 will make it that much more fun.
Good luck getting it drivable. Sounds like you have your hands full, with garage work. (We can relate). Would be nice to see your 70 cars progress. Got any photos, or a link to a build thread?

[kentucky yeti]

I've started with them a lot worse than that.  That one is pretty darn nice!

[72projectbird]

Wow. For an upper New England F-body, the car looks really good underneath. And the ST-10 will make it that much more fun.
Good luck getting it drivable. Sounds like you have your hands full, with garage work. (We can relate). Would be nice to see your 70 cars progress. Got any photos, or a link to a build thread?

I had a thread here, but it's gone now. I still have one going on over at PY: https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=821237

I haven't updated it in a while. It's been slow going, but it's a 100% numbers matching car from carb to pan, radiator to rear axle, so I don't mind taking my time.

[tajoe]

Just checked out your link. Great find.
I missed out on a similar car, about 20 years ago, matching #s, that was a driver, and not much rust or rot. The guy got it for $1700, or so he said. He gave me the original QJ to rebuild, and I couldn't get the accelerator pump to shoot correctly. I finally noticed the bottom of the accelerator pump well, had corroded just enuff, to lose the seal on the umbrella. It was a bummer, cause it was the right carb. I changed out the main body to an extra one I had, but of course, the numbers didn't match. Gave him back his original body, not knowing if someone has a sleeve for them.

And I see all your other project cars going on. Tough hobby, don't-cha-think? With work, and family duties, and obligations, I don't know how anyone can finish anything. These things are such time, and money eaters, I wish I were more passionate about something like.... (I can't even think of a less extensive hobby. Gardening? Kite flying? Stamp collecting? Whatever) Hope you continue to make progress on your 70 car. Maybe you could continue it here?

[FormTA]

Kite flying!!    lol

[72projectbird]

I test fit the FiTech throttle body today. I was surprised to find it fits under the shaker base no problem. It's installed in the pic, and you cant tell at all.

I removed the intake so I can modify it to fit the throttle body. I need to open up the 4 individual holes designed for a Q-Jet and make them two large openings, like a typical dual plane into. I could use a spreadbore adapter, but it would push the shaker up too high, and then I'd need a drop base. I'm not doing that nonsense. The 4 center bolts on the intake were a nightmare. They rotted to the point they looked like carriage bolts. A cut off wheel, air hammer, and stripped bolt sockets eventually got them out.

[5th T/A]

I think it’s great you are keeping the factory intake and air cleaner. Everything I have read the factory intake flows better than the Edelbrock Performer and equal with the performer RPM. It took a lot of work and a drop base air cleaner to make my FAST EFI fit right with the shaker. It looks like FITech is the way to go. Also, can’t help but notice how much more room in the engine compartment without factory AC.

Nice you found a real survivor!

[FormTA]

I may have missed it but was there a conversation about the FITech?

A friend of mine and I are both considering it for different projects. These are just basic cruisers so they don't need anything too fancy, just want to get close to the optimal air fuel ratio so you can just jump in and drive.

[72projectbird]

I may have missed it but was there a conversation about the FITech?

A friend of mine and I are both considering it for different projects. These are just basic cruisers so they don't need anything too fancy, just want to get close to the optimal air fuel ratio so you can just jump in and drive.

That's what I want out of this build. I love fuel injection, and since I'll be driving this car a lot, to me it's the only way to go. However, I realize it's a pretty rare car, so I'm doing it in a way that is 100% reversible.

Not having to modify the shaker base is huge. I have some other ones laying around that I was gonna cut up if I needed to, but using 90 degree fittings on the fuel lines going into the throttle body makes it clear. 90s aren't ideal for fuel flow, but this 400 isn't making much power so it'll be fine.

[Jack]

Very clean car and hard to believe it was originally from Maine.

[72projectbird]

Very clean car and hard to believe it was originally from Maine.

It is pretty clean. It needs a lower quarter on the driver side, and in front of the rear wheels behind the spoilers. The floor pan is rough on the passenger side and a little under the rear seats, but not horrible. Rather than puzzle piece those patches in, I got a one piece floor pan that goes from the firewall to the rear seats. Should look good. After that it'll get sand blasted underneath and I'll repaint the red oxide primer. For now though, it's just getting the mechanicals and I'm driving it until the winter

[72projectbird]

I started cutting the intake today. I put on a 4 hole gasket to give a visual on what's getting chopped out. I got it roughly cut out, and JB Welded the EGR hole closed on the inside of the intake. I'll blend it and snap a pic when it's done.

[FormTA]

JB weld on the inside? That seems a little scary to me. What if the vibration causes it to come lose and it gets sucked into a cylinder? Just asking because I would worry about that.

[tajoe]

Square bore carb? What happened to the QJ? (Just outta curiosity).

[ryeguy2006a]

I like it! Actually they say that with fuel injection carbs like that, having an open plenum helps with the drivability. you may almost be better off just cutting it all out and shaping in a divider. 

[72projectbird]

The JB Weld shouldn't go anywhere. I've used it before to patch/plug egr ports and even to fix water jackets in cylinder heads that were ported just a tad too much. The egr opening on this intake is probably 60-70 degrees upright, so it would need to break free, be sucked up towards the throttle body before being able to fall down the intake.

I still have the original Q-jet. It needs to be rebuilt. I figured I'd rather spend the money fuel injecting it than deal with the carb. I'll rebuild it down the road.

The intake will be cut pretty much all out, with only the center divider in place. It'll basically look like a standard dual plane. I'll grab some pics of it today

[scarebird]

I like it! Actually they say that with fuel injection carbs like that, having an open plenum helps with the drivability. you may almost be better off just cutting it all out and shaping in a divider.

Concur.  Most efficient solution and no blowback if you decide to go carb.  If you are going EFI I would examine Edelbrock Pro-Flo 4 which is port injection and controls the distributor too.

[72projectbird]

Heres a pic after the rough cut (very rough). I'll get in there and smooth out and blend everything nicely with a burr bit.

[tajoe]

Way cool. Lots more room. Looks like fun.

[Jack]

Very nice work as usual.

[72projectbird]

Got the intake blended out, installed with new gaskets, and got the throttle body on. Ran the fuel lines, which is Fragola Push-lok in -6AN. Got the fuel pump mounted out back. Just have a little wiring to do, and it'll be done.

[tajoe]

Next photo, two very long black stripes...on the pavement. 

[72projectbird]

Update:


Called tech support. They say it sounds like the ecu is dead. They want $250 to look at it. Asked if I could return the unit and they hung up. 


Screw them, screw this shitty ass unit, and I'm going with a Holley Sniper as soon as they're in stock again. I guess for now I'll rebuild the Q-Jet and suffer with that thing.

[5th T/A]

The throttle body looks brand new, shouldn't this be covered by warranty?

[72projectbird]

The throttle body looks brand new, shouldn't this be covered by warranty?

Who knows. I already got my money back so it's a moot point.


Now I'm dealing with carburetor shops that dont want to rebuild carbs unless they're practically new. Well if they were functioning properly, I wouldn't need your services now would I?

[72projectbird]

Put its first miles on it. Just a little shake down to see what it needs and what can wait. The power steering pump is a little weak and noisy when turning while not moving. The clutch release point is on the high side, but seems to grab ok. Oil pressure is good. Overall not too bad for sitting 27 years!


A little black duct tape takes care of the seat covers for the time being. Installed a spare pioneer head unit I had on the shelf in the console (not cutting the dash) and some 6x9s out back. Sounds pretty good.

[tajoe]

Great job on the photos. Glad to see you've got a driver. Enjoy that stick shift. How's the syncros? What gear, in the rear?

[72projectbird]

Great job on the photos. Glad to see you've got a driver. Enjoy that stick shift. How's the syncros? What gear, in the rear?

Syncros are good. I believe it's a 3.23 rear gear. Even the back drive linkage is still hooked up, so reverse lights work and you need to put it in reverse to get the key out of the column.

It's nice working on a car that has never been apart before!

[tajoe]

"SWEET"

[5th T/A]

Congratulations should be a ton of fun. Best thing about a driver is you get a little stone chip or small ding, it's not the end of the world.

Looking forward to driving impressions? Not sure if you mentioned it, are the tires safe?

[72projectbird]

Congratulations should be a ton of fun. Best thing about a driver is you get a little stone chip or small ding, it's not the end of the world.

Looking forward to driving impressions? Not sure if you mentioned it, are the tires safe?

So far it feels pretty good. Throw out bearing is a little noisy, but the trans shifts fine. I went through the brakes and they're super strong. Wheel bearings feel good, although I'll probably end up replacing them anyway.

I replaced the tires. They're balanced perfectly, and the car goes down the road pretty straight. All the gauges work, even the clock lol.

Right now the blower motor isn't turning on. Not a huge deal, but it would be nice to have a heater in the fall so I'll be diagnosing that soon.

[72projectbird]

Found the PHS for it. Doesn't have a whole lot of options, but has some good ones.

[5th T/A]

Two great options, Y82 and W72.

W72 was the best performance deal ever offered by Pontiac.

[Maxthe222]

That's a pretty poggers score, bit of a poverty pack Y82, but it has all the main things someone would look for, Y82, W72 and deluxe interior. That makes for a really great beater!

[tajoe]

"4 speed manual transmission"...free?

[72projectbird]

That's a pretty poggers score, bit of a poverty pack Y82, but it has all the main things someone would look for, Y82, W72 and deluxe interior. That makes for a really great beater!

It's like I ordered it personally! I love the deluxe interiors on these cars, and wouldn't order any options myself besides Y82, W72 and deluxe interior. The tinted glass is odd on a heat only car. Iirc tinted glass was mandatory on AC cars, but rarely seen on heat only cars.

"4 speed manual transmission"...free?

I believe the 4 speed was standard equipment, with the auto being an extra cost option. It's funny though, Pontiac used M21 as the option code, but by 77 they were Borg Warner transmissions

[tajoe]

I like the strippers too. At least on a performance car. Give me the go fast options, and screw the rest. More room, less weight, cost, and maintenance.

[FormTA]

There is a joke in there but I'll skip it. 

[Maxthe222]

"4 speed manual transmission"...free?

Technically, you had to pay for the extra cost with the W72, so if you wanted a manual, you had to pay at least $50 extra