Author Topic: 424 Oldsmobile Stroker 403  (Read 3531 times)

lugnuts

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Re: 424 Oldsmobile Stroker 403
« Reply #40 on: November 19, 2018, 10:00:50 AM »
I thought you were going with the smaller AC compressor?
Check out the progress of my restoration on my YouTube Channel. Click here: TheOriginalLugnuts (Updated Weekly)
  
" daddy my hat blew off, I hope your darn head was in it"

olds403

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Re: 424 Oldsmobile Stroker 403
« Reply #41 on: November 19, 2018, 10:10:57 AM »
This is my dad’s car.  The sanden went on my Red Trans am. I tend to be the guinea pig for test and mock ups. 


kingwil

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Re: 424 Oldsmobile Stroker 403
« Reply #42 on: January 08, 2019, 04:02:13 PM »
any updates on this 424 Stroker 403 Olds Build? 
79 Nocturne Blue 403 Firebird TA
72 Viking Blue 455 Cutlass Convertible

olds403

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Re: 424 Oldsmobile Stroker 403
« Reply #43 on: January 12, 2019, 10:32:35 PM »
The shop is doing a 64 vette 427 swap.  We are scheduled at end of the
this month.  We also lost our painter to cancer so that changes the plan quite a bit. 

Nexus

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Re: 424 Oldsmobile Stroker 403
« Reply #44 on: February 04, 2019, 03:22:18 PM »
Hope things are well, and getting sorted out!!
Charlie

79 Esprit but like many, it will be a T/A clone
(18 years and counting but still have her)

Re: 424 Oldsmobile Stroker 403
« Reply #44 on: February 04, 2019, 03:22:18 PM »

olds403

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Re: 424 Oldsmobile Stroker 403
« Reply #45 on: February 10, 2019, 05:24:01 PM »
It is Alive Feb 10, 2019


The expression on my Dad's face was worth the 18 months of hard work that everyone all put into this day. 
Would not have been possible without the help of the following:

My wife - thought she would have killed me by now. The countless trips to the machine shop, fed ex, ups, and phone calls.  Trips to the shop some 45 mins each way. 
My brother - for all the help along the way. 
My dad - who pulled this all together after 25 yrs. 
Restoration, Machine Shops and Suppliers. 
Jackson Racing
Precision Engines
Champion Racing Heads
J&S Machine
Mark Remmel - Cutlass EFI

The video is on YouTube as photobucket is worthless now

VIDEO LINK:
https://youtu.be/p4_oCtgfCDg







Aus78Formula

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Re: 424 Oldsmobile Stroker 403
« Reply #46 on: February 10, 2019, 06:05:14 PM »
Fantastic!

Jack

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  • 1971 Esprit TA Clone W72 1972 Formula 68 350 HO
Re: 424 Oldsmobile Stroker 403
« Reply #47 on: February 10, 2019, 06:50:42 PM »
Sounds awesome.




Regards, Jack

Nexus

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Re: 424 Oldsmobile Stroker 403
« Reply #48 on: February 11, 2019, 10:53:37 AM »
Oh Yeah...that's a great sound!!!

Charlie

79 Esprit but like many, it will be a T/A clone
(18 years and counting but still have her)

lugnuts

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Re: 424 Oldsmobile Stroker 403
« Reply #49 on: February 11, 2019, 11:43:53 AM »
What a difference, can't wait to see what numbers this car puts down.
Check out the progress of my restoration on my YouTube Channel. Click here: TheOriginalLugnuts (Updated Weekly)
  
" daddy my hat blew off, I hope your darn head was in it"

kingwil

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Re: 424 Oldsmobile Stroker 403
« Reply #50 on: April 08, 2019, 02:33:00 PM »
Any plans to put this car on a Chassis Dyno and see how the rebuilt 403 (aka 424ci) does for HP and Torque, and what the RPM range is? 
79 Nocturne Blue 403 Firebird TA
72 Viking Blue 455 Cutlass Convertible

olds403

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Re: 424 Oldsmobile Stroker 403
« Reply #51 on: April 11, 2019, 09:08:55 PM »
Not with this one right now.  Give this until later this year.
Working on an extreme olds stroker small block.  I bought a 4” stroked crank last year ~ one of a dozen in existence.  Not much more to say...things are a bit slow now .

kingwil

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Re: 424 Oldsmobile Stroker 403
« Reply #52 on: May 28, 2019, 03:07:37 PM »
Any updates on the 424ci build?  Chassis Dyno Tests?   Earlier, maybe on page one of this posting, you provided a UTube Video of an Olds 403 stroked to 422ci with what looks to be Edelbrock Aluminum Big Block Heads (in the video) and this 422ci Small block Olds put out 570 HP and 540 Torque on the dyno.  Now, they didn't provide all the info/specs on the engine in the video, but I've heard that the Edelbrock Olds Heads can flow 290 to 300 cfm right out of the box and I think your #6 Heads flow around 250 cfm.

Since you mentioned that your 424ci engine build is modeled after the 422ci in the video, are you suggesting that the 424ci build will generate 550 HP or better with 9.7:1 compression, small block heads that flow 250 cfm, and a hydraulic roller cam with 227/233 duration @ .050 and lift in the .560 range? 
   
79 Nocturne Blue 403 Firebird TA
72 Viking Blue 455 Cutlass Convertible

Nexus

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Re: 424 Oldsmobile Stroker 403
« Reply #53 on: May 28, 2019, 08:19:10 PM »
^^^^^Good Question ^^^^^^^
Charlie

79 Esprit but like many, it will be a T/A clone
(18 years and counting but still have her)

olds403

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Re: 424 Oldsmobile Stroker 403
« Reply #54 on: May 30, 2019, 09:24:32 PM »
The small blocks 6 heads flowed 244 / 154 at .500. 
Stock edelbrocks are basically Iron c heads.  They flowed 238/172 at .500 out of the box.  I had an early set of these and was playing with them for something else. 

That 424 won’t be chassis dyno’ed or see results for a while.  The shop guy had some health issues and will be lucky to see paint by end of the year.  This motor was done locally and wont be using them again.  If you get all the parts its a good build.  Though probably not very durable. 

When i get time I will post the LS Olds later in the year.  It will be an extreme motor. 


Re: 424 Oldsmobile Stroker 403
« Reply #54 on: May 30, 2019, 09:24:32 PM »



Nexus

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Re: 424 Oldsmobile Stroker 403
« Reply #55 on: June 01, 2019, 12:34:51 AM »
Waiting with anticipation!!!
Charlie

79 Esprit but like many, it will be a T/A clone
(18 years and counting but still have her)

kingwil

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Re: 424 Oldsmobile Stroker 403
« Reply #56 on: June 13, 2019, 03:08:12 PM »
I have a few more questions about the Cam you are using in your 424ci SBO.  I think you stated that "The cam is 227/232 @.050 with .561 intake and .551 exhaust on 112 center".  My question pertains to how the engine runs and idles, and what type of vacuum the engine pulls with this Hydraulic Roller Cam, as it relates to power accessories.  A lot of 79 TAs have Power 4-wheel disc brakes, Powering Steering, and A/C.  Will the power accessories operate with this cam at idle?  Is there enough vacuum to operate Power Brakes at low RPM or idle?  Or would an electric vacuum pump or vacuum canister be needed with a Cam in the 230 @ .050 duration range?                                             
79 Nocturne Blue 403 Firebird TA
72 Viking Blue 455 Cutlass Convertible

olds403

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Re: 424 Oldsmobile Stroker 403
« Reply #57 on: June 16, 2019, 10:44:03 AM »
Hello, the cam is on 112 centers.  The car does not have power brakes- hydroboost. 
Its a custom made cam and it was a lunati.  The cam was spec’ed by Mark Remmel based on the combo and the heads/compression.  Its a lot smoother than you would think.  All the parts and heads cam from Mark minus the block machining that was done locally.  Its a big expense going roller as heads too need different springs. 

Just contact Mark ~ here is a link
https://classicoldsmobile.com/forums/big-blocks-2/mark-remmel-109733/

kingwil

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Re: 424 Oldsmobile Stroker 403
« Reply #58 on: June 19, 2019, 04:29:58 PM »
Thanks Olds403.  I've been following your thread and asking questions because I want to make some upgrades in the future to my car.  I have a 403 in a 79 TA that I rebuilt back in 1999 and made some mistakes along the way.  Haven't we all?  More on the mistakes, later.  First, the car specs and then the engine rebuild info:

1979 Firebird TA with 403/TH350 with 2.73 rear end with T-Tops and WS6 handling package with 4 wheel disc brakes and 15X8 Aluminum Snowflakes.  Power windows, power door locks, power brakes, power steering, and A/C.

Car over the years has been modified after I got it in 1986 after High School:

TH700R4 Automatic Overdrive in place of TH350.  2400 stall in TH700R4, race-prepped to handle 700HP.  B&M 4-Speed console Mega Shifter in place of factory 3-speed auto shifter.
4.10 posi 8.5" 10-bolt Differential in place of factory 2.73 10-bolt 8.5 diff.  4.10 posi rear end race-prepped and rated to handle 750HP
Competition Engineering bolt-in sub-frame connectors, welded in after bolted.
Southside Subframe Connectors welded on top of Competition Engineering bolt-in connectors.  * Sub-frame connectors added to strengthen the car with T-Tops.
Herb Adams VSE Solid Body Mounts
Hooker 4-pt Rally/Roll Bar
Herb Adams VSE Front Structure Kit.  This adds structure bars from the Firewall to the front control A-Arms and stiffens the front subframe.  Works well with the solid body mounts.  No flex in the front sub-frame.
Competition Engineering Traction Bars on the Back
15X8 WS6 Aluminum Snowflake Wheels with P255/60R15s front, and P275/60R15's in the Rear.

Engine Specs - some very similar to your 424ci build.  Intent was to create a W-31 403:

.030 over 403 - now 408ci.  TRW power-forged pistons with 20cc dish
#5 1969 W31 Heads milled to 62ccs with 2" intake and 1.625 exhaust valves
Heads flow 238 cfm @ .500 lift on intake and 161 cfm on exhaust
Rods resized
Torque Plate used on Block
Compression with Block decked to .020, is 9.6:1
3.385" Nodular Iron Crankshaft shotpeened and nitrided for extra hardness
Total Seal Rings, Michigan/Clevite 77 Bearings top to bottom
Mondello Oil Restrictors
Mondello Stud & Strap Kit
Mondello Windage Tray
Melling high-volume Oil Pump
Hydraulic Cam with 204/214 @ .050 duration and .450/.475 lift with roller-tip valve train
Headers and 2/1/2" Pypes Exhaust
Edelbrock Performer Intake Manifold
Holley 750 Vacuum Secondary
HEI Distributor rebuilt and re-curved with Accel Super Coil
K&N Filter with K&N Filter Top Plate

On a Chassis Dyno, on 3 pulls with timing set at 35, results were 269, 272, and 271 Net HP at the rear wheels.  Suggesting, that Engine HP at the crank may be around 340HP.   

This car does run 13's on the strip due to the TH700R4 having a 3.06:1 1st gear and the rear end being 4.10, which is significantly higher than a Car with a TH400 (2.48:1 1st gear) and 4.56 gears.  On the highway, with lockup, the final gear ratio is 2.89 on the TH700R4 / 4.10 posi combo.

Although some may consider this to be a minor engine build, the obvious weak point is the 204/214 Cam, which isn't that much higher than stock.  The Chassis Dyno results from 1999 also determined the 204/214 cam was too small, as peak power was in the 4200-4400 range.  Hence, this was the most glaring mistake in the Engine build.  But, a lot of the rest of the engine build, is similar to your 424ci. 

So, I am looking at everything from putting in a hydraulic roller cam closer to your specs of 227/233, to also considering a 3.77" custom billet crankshaft to increase the 403 to 455 cubes, or putting in a 4" crankshaft with 6" rods to yield 482ci, along with increasing flow on the #5 heads, to strengthening the bottom end.

I have no plans to remove the A/C, power steering, or power 4-wheel disc brakes from the car, or any other power accessories.  So, vacuum is very important to keep the power accessories going at idle or cruise RPM.  This is the reason I am asking about your 227/233 Hydraulic Roller Cam with .561 lift on 112 LSA.  Some people are suggesting that I might be able to get away with a hydraulic roller cam with 230/236 @ .050 duration with .530 lift and a LSA of 114.  And, add an electric vacuum pump.  Some are recommending a cam with 244 - 260 duration and lift from .550 to .620, forgetting that I am not yanking the A/C, Power Steering, and Power 4-Wheel Disc Brakes from the car.  But, the bigger cam recommendations are coming from those thinking I have a stripped down car, solely for racing.     

I will contact Mark Remmel and see what he says on the Cam.  Thanks again for your help. 
             
79 Nocturne Blue 403 Firebird TA
72 Viking Blue 455 Cutlass Convertible

olds403

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Re: 424 Oldsmobile Stroker 403
« Reply #59 on: June 21, 2019, 01:39:03 PM »
Lots of good information there and we are probably close in age.  Got my red TA in 1986 in high school. 

Couple of things.  Bigger cam and a rpm intake will wake it up.  You can put a bit more cam duration/lift into a roller setup, but you will need to redo your springs in heads along with knowing the installed heights of the valves so they don’t bind with more lift.  Just depends on how far you will be going.  Heads too probably will need a redo with roller.  Stock intake / ebrock performer will not clear roller lifters.  Only the Rpm and the old holley dominator.


Otherwise,  everything is a redo once you go beyond the cam change. 

Fyi, The early 350 olds blocks are better foundation for higher horse power as they are solid main as that is where the 4” cranks are going.  Which gets up to 434 cubic inch.  Mark may have a person putting a 4” crank into a 403, but lots of money gone should block fail.  I think the 403 would need a full girdle.  I don’t want to say what I am doing next - Mark may tell you that is fine and no one has ever done what I am planning. 


Re: 424 Oldsmobile Stroker 403
« Reply #59 on: June 21, 2019, 01:39:03 PM »
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